Right Hand Drill and Impact

Dear Greg,

I have spent some time again looking at your right hand and impact drill. I still have problems with following the logic. Maybe if I ask a few questions you can help me with my understanding:

1) In both drills you suggest the shoulders rotate well past horizontal at the impact position, I think you say they should rotate 180 deg so they are facing the target. I have always believed the shoulders should be square to or only very slightly open to the target at impact.

2) To maintain a cupped right wrist the right arm would be bent at the elbow at impact. I have always straightened the right arm through impact to create maximum speed and force, I also push the right wrist under my left to create additional speed and keep the clubface square to the target longer. Can you explain further please?

3) At what point exactly do you lose the cup in the right hand ?

Thanks in anticipation.

__________________
Best Regards
Brian

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Funny o'l game!

"...they should rotate 180 deg so they are facing the target."
This is a goal. 180 deg is probably way too far for most. The idea I am trying to relay here is that if you rotate past imact, you have used your shoulders mainly to create the rotatonal power, and took the focus of a power generator away from the arms and hands. What I see quite a lot in amatures is the arms and hands being used first, then the shoulders rotating BECASE the arms are being thrusted at the ball...what you described as "pulling" the club. In my lessons, I want to get you to stop worring about the arms and hands (in a flipping/swatting mannor), and use powerful parts first (lower body and shoulders). If you do, you will be better at control (what the arms and hands are good at) while making powerful swings (what the legs, torso and shoulders ar good at).

"...To maintain a cupped right wrist the right arm would be bent at the elbow at impact"
Yes. Leading into impact, keeping a relaxed right arm and wrist allows the shoulders to fully rotate. This goes with the fully rotating shoulders. A straight and firm right arm at impact will not work with fully rotated shoulders...you would have your arms already pointing to the target and not in the impact position. So this makes sense why you are having a hard time with the shoulders position. To do my drills you have to change both, and this is what is giving you problems with doing just one.

Are my drills gospel? No. It is however what I like to advocate and have had success both in using and teaching it. But try both items (relaxed right arm/wrist AND fully rotating the shoulders) and then make your assesmentif you want to continue incorporating it into your swing. I bet you will get laser like accuracy AND consistant power.

__________________
I'm a golfaholic, no question about that. Counseling wouldn't help me. They'd have to put me in prison, and then I'd talk the warden into building a hole or two and teach him how to play. ~Lee Trevino

Greg,

Thank you very much for your reply. I think that explains a lot and has clarified things. I will ponder on the exercises a bit and see if they are something I can use.

Again, thanks.

<< 3. At what point exactly do you lose the cup in your right hand ? >>

Nobody as answered this yet ?

I'm presuming in the drill you keep the cup in your right hand at impact. And during your normal swing you lose the cup just before impact.

Am I right about this ?

I used to be. I changed to a one plane swing some time ago, it has helped me to keep on plane and path better and has created a more reliable, compact and powerful swing that has great repeatability.

I have a little third hand knowledge that says tour pros average the shoulders to be 17* open at impact with a six iron, so obviously some are more and some are less. If you try to get to gregs 180, which you obviously will not, you should be in pretty good shape. the objective is that the hips outrace the shoulders, the shoulders outrace that hands and the hands outrace the clubhead. Another drill is to take three balls and put them in an arc, the one you are going to hit, another one past impact about four inches and 4 inches inside of that, and another that is four inches forward of th second ball and four inches inside that as well. Mentally tell yourself at impact to have your hips face at the ball furthest forward, shoulders at the next ball, and hands ahead of the ball you are hitting

what happens if I am a more rounded swinger? something like moe norman? would I need to add something extra to the right hand drill.
hope Greg or Cmays can help me with this.

What does everyone think of "Jim Flick" who advocates the opposite. The arms lead and pull the shoulders going back and through??

So this is 107* rotation (assuming the back swing was 90*). That extra 17* past impact is the key..."Past". Thanks Shootin’ for knowing this!

(I will let you in on one of my tricks to teaching: exaggerate. Saying one thing to student will cause them to attempt that idea. More often, the body’s natural resistance fights the thought. Exaggerating the thought will get the new change past the body's ability to resist. I expect natural "return back to normal"-ness, so what results is where I want them to be...changed just enough. This can backfire sometimes, and when I see this, I readjust saying, "Wow, that was amazing! And too amazing if you can believe it...take 1/2 that and you are there." All these being positive statements that get the result I want. So take the RHD and Wall Drill. Both exaggerations designed to produce a thought into the head that this is moving you towards where I want your to be...RHD fixing a swatter - right hand passing the impact before the arms get there, and the Wall Drill fixing an arm-only swinger -- getting the hips and shoulders passing before the arms. Both drills forcing you past normal...way past normal, with exaggeration knowing that you will go back to something in the middle in real-time full swings on the course when you are not thinking about mechanics).

__________________
I'm a golfaholic, no question about that. Counseling wouldn't help me. They'd have to put me in prison, and then I'd talk the warden into building a hole or two and teach him how to play. ~Lee Trevino

your welcome Greg
did you mean 107* of rotation from top of the backswing?

Sorry, yes...fixed. Thanks. No one said I was good at math.

did not want to seem nitpicky, just wanted to make sure I understood what you were saying.