flagstick problem

Is it a penalty if you remove the ball from the cup with the flagstick after holing out from off of the green?

I really don't see how it would be.........I've seen it on tv too many times...........Even when they hole out for eagle on par 4's.

No, but I'm pretty sure the rules state that if the ball stays in the cup then hit's ruled to have been holed, otherwiseI think you add a stroke.

Those more knowledgable than I should chime in shortly.

I didn't read it correctly ..................remove the ball from the hole with the flag stick............So I don't know............Cancel my post because I couldn't delete it.

Thanks for your feedback! I think it is a penalty if the ball is removed by the flagstick, you never see the pros do it!

Thanks for you time!

Rule 17 states:

"When the flagstick is in the hole and a player's ball when not holed rests against it, the olayer or another person authorised by him may move or remove the flagstick and if the ball falls into the hole, the player is deemed to have holed out with his last stroke; otherwise, the ball, if moved, must be placed on the lip of the hole, without penalty. "


There is no rule stating how the ball should be removed from the hole.

I would think that to be able to remove the ball from the hole with the flagstick, the ball must lie within the hole, and therefore has been holed, and therefore is not is play and you cannot accumlate any penalties with a ball not in play other than doing something like hurling it at a competitor in vengeful wrath and incurring a Rule 1 penalty.

Moreover, how would you remove a ball from a hole with a flagstick? It sounds like a tremendously difficult exercise - the kind of impossible challenge that one tries on a Friday night when the beer goggles are firmly attached?

__________________
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Personal bests 2007;
Best 18: 78 (+12)
Best 9: 37 (+4)
Best Stableford: 45 pts
Best total putts: 28
Best total length sunk putts (ft): 54

Club tourney history this year: Captain's Day - 1st; Club foursomes - 2nd; Dimex Stableford - 2nd; Club Championship - 13/28 gross, joint 5/28 nett; Ferebee Shield - 2nd; Sept Medal 2nd; Autumn Stableford - 1st

The next time you're out, bulldog, for shits and giggles, put the pin in after you're done putting (hopefully no one is behind you) throw a ball in there, and then pull the pin. Watch what happens.

If you pull the pin up fast, the ball will come with it (the metal part at the bottom will pull the ball up. Generally, unless you pull the pin up pretty straight, the wobble in the tip will kick the ball away from the hole. Hence - you would place your ball on the lip and have to take 1 more stroke to hole out. Sometimes the ball falls back in the hole (deemed to have holed out with your last stroke).

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LP, I'm sure I'm being obtuse about your last post, but if you're saying when you pull the pin out fast the ball comes out with it, and therefore that refutes my last point about how hard it would be to remove the ball with the flagstick, I stand corrected, and my planned Friday night beered-up activity has all gone to hell.

If you're saying the ball is somehow back in play (and I'm sure you aren't, but I don't get what you are saying, the ball is either fully in the hole ('holed' in which case you can do what you like with the stick because the ball is out of play) or it is not fully holed but leaning against the stick, in which case the player or someone duly authorised can move it and if it drops in the hole, it is holed, otherwise it is replaced on the lip.

No part of that, AFAIK, involves removing the stick - just tilting it to see if the ball drops. It's certainly not 'removing the ball from the cup with the flagstick'?

Or have I - as ever - gone barking up the wrong tree?

__________________
~_~_~_~_~
Personal bests 2007;
Best 18: 78 (+12)
Best 9: 37 (+4)
Best Stableford: 45 pts
Best total putts: 28
Best total length sunk putts (ft): 54

Club tourney history this year: Captain's Day - 1st; Club foursomes - 2nd; Dimex Stableford - 2nd; Club Championship - 13/28 gross, joint 5/28 nett; Ferebee Shield - 2nd; Sept Medal 2nd; Autumn Stableford - 1st

Nope - my bad - I misread the original situation. It's akin to ball wedged between the flagstick and the lip of the cup - not fully below the level of the hole.

You are referencing a ball that is fully below the level of the hole - yes, holed out, no further actions.

Sorry - my misunderstanding caused confusion.

Nagem, don't go penalising any of your buddies with this one, I think you are barking.........up the wrong tree.





Rule 17-4
Holing Ball with Flagstick in Hole after Stroke from off Putting Green
Q. Jeff played a stroke from off the putting green. The ball came to rest in the hole, leaning against the flagstick, and all of the ball was below the lip of the hole. What should Jeff do?
A. Jeff`s ball is holed. The provisions of Rule 17-4 do not apply once the ball is holed. (Definition of "Holed" and Rule 17-4)

Correct me if I'm wrong but I'm under the impression that the thread is about whether or not you can pull the ball out of the hole with the flag stick?????. .....Maybe I missed something.

Seems to be well covered to me, the ball is below the lip of the hole therefore it is holed. No other rules(17-4) apply because the ball is holed. There is no rule on how you remove your ball from the hole.

Okie Dokie