Half two-plane swing

In the Two Plane Swing, your shoulders rotate back and you lift up your arms, right? So when you do a half or shorter swing, is it half lift and half rotate, or less rotate and more lifting?

Full roate, 1/2 lift

How much lifting should there been in a normal full swing? I've been focussing on turning my shoulders recently, but not sure how much I should be lifting my arms at the same time? Or are they just lifted by the shoulders?

Good follow-up question jweighell, I was about to ask that too :P In my current swing, I try to lift my arms up until I can feel my left upper arm/shoulder actually touching my chin. I understand that with the longer clubs, the swing plane should be less steep, but it should not be a conscious effort. My question is : is one supposed to adjust the height of the hands depending on which club is being swung, or should it be the same feeling (same height)?

I am not sure if it's worthwhile to note at this point whether you are a one-plane swinger or a two-plane swinger. I started out as a two-plane swing but somehow over the months think I've started doing a bit of both, which was not good. So now I'm going back to basics just like when I first started out, breaking the back swing basically into two components - the rotation of the shoulders to go back, and the lifting of the arms to go up.

Simon, thats brilliant advice. I think theres a lot of advice offered (myself included) where it doesnt state if its 1 or 2 plane. Theres a difference becuase if you set up as a 1 planer and make a 2 plane swing you'll be hosed. Hardys book 'Plane Truth' is a great read for all the differences. Thus if you hear somene say 'stay connected' on the backswing, that may not be good advice for the 2 planer, since the arms have to swing up as the body turns back

As an example in a 2 plane, you should not try and restrict your hip turn. Theres no X-Factor (this is all according to Hardy BTW). Speed comes from your arm swing and wrist hinge

What is a two plane swing as opposed to a one plane swing . I haven't a clue which one I may be doing..

I think I have a one plane back swing with a two plane down swing, with a little Hocky Hitch in between. It is all confusing. I did learn something from Greg. I thought on a 1/2 swing one would take a 1/2 turn and 1/2 lift. Greg. is your advice, on this, the same for both the one and two plane?

Yes. When you are inside the 1/2 swing, it starts to be a bit more of a different set of rules and techniques, but this question was on the 1/2 swing...1p or 2p it is the same.

Always create a full turn ack and through whenever possible. Adjusting the arm hight and hand release is always last. Why? Accerlation from the bottom up is always prefered in a game of consistancy. Never try to shorten a base and lengthen the lever...the lever becomes unstable.

You wouldn't want to come to Lake Kiowa Tx. and give me some lessons would you?

That's an interesting point which I brought up in another thread regarding the arms/hands height. Do you good players actually know which height to go for each club (short iron or long wood?) and each shot (half swing or full swing), or is that something which you don't even think about, or perhaps something which does not have to be cast in stone (in which case whichever height you end up with on the backswing, you will naturally know how to bring it back down to the precise position on impact)?

I was messing around with this last night at the range

For a 2p swing, I would make a connected one piece turn away from the ball until the club was parallel to the ground and in a line across the top of my shoelaces (or very slightly behind). My wrists would be hinged by this point.

From that position I was hitting easy 7i's about 140 yards, basically knockdowns which in all honesty id foegotten how to play. So my half swing was all turn

From that half way position I would then simply lift my arms so that the club shaft would drop on my right shoulder at the top. I did this by using my right hand to pull my left thumb upwards, keeping the left arm straight. Turn and lift, the 2 plane swing

I then started creaming everything .. with every club in the bag. Indeed way better/longer than i've been hitting with my flatter One Plane Swing swing and being able to shape the ball both ways with ease. So much so that im going to have to back at lunch today to see if it was a fluke or if I need to seriously reconsider going back to more of a Two Plane Swing

[quote=pnearn]I was messing around with this last night at the range

For a 2p swing, I would make a connected one piece turn away from the ball until the club was parallel to the ground and in a line across the top of my shoelaces (or very slightly behind). My wrists would be hinged by this point.quote]

I am still a little confused. Do you mean the club, or your left arm, was parallel to the ground. Were you taking a 90 degree shoulder turn? It seems that if the CLUB was parallel, you would have no wrist cock at all. Also, if either the left arm or club was parallel to the ground, it would be impossible to have made a full, 90 degree, shoulder turn.

Are you saying: bring the left arm parallel to the ground, cock your wrist (club pointing straight up), then without raising the arms any further, complete your full 90 degree shoulder turn?

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SneakyShort

Its hard to describe in words but what I was doing was to make a connected swing. That is use my body(chest) to turn the triangle and take the club back on a wide semi-circle until my ARMS were parallel to the ground. At this point my wrists (which I keep very soft in this movment) have hinged

Have a look at GregH's backswing lessons

http://www.golf-tuition-online.com/g...backswing.html

I would guess I am maybe a little more inside of where he is on the takeaway ( as thats where the body turn takes me) and my wrists work up the same as he does in the second picture

does that make any sense whatsoever

It makes sense to me pnearn. I do the first part of that or a 1/2 swing. That is where I'm staying for now. I am making good contact and hitting em straight by going to parallel, cock and then swing. Cream them as far as distance? Probably not, but very effective for me just to gain some consistency. Also, I am trying to develop some feel for my swing and get out of my head for a while. As you know.

But do I understand you to say, that the second plane is when you further turn your chest/shoulders back or around before you begin your forward swing.

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I would suggest that any golfer who says they've never thrown a club is either a liar or a poser. To all of you "gentlemen golfers" out there, respectively..
Jim

Pnearn, if I am not wrong, you are doing a connected inside backswing, so that by the time your hands are parallel to the ground and your wrists have set, the club should be pointing behind you almost vertical towards the sky? So I guess moving from that to a full swing, is more or less a matter of how high you raise the hands? And if I'm not wrong, this is what Greg means by full rotate, half lift, right? Heh hope we are all on the same frequency now :P

Have also been mucking around with the half swings and playing around with the rotation vs lifting etc. What I seem to conclude out of this is that the most important factor is that you must have set your wrists fully. Any thoughts from you guys on this?