Extensor Action and left wrist cup

I had the pleasure yesterday of spending some time at the range with a guys who plays in my sweep who is a TGM'er. Id been trying to get him up the range for me for weeks! He explained some TGM concepts to me (in english!) and I must admit they bought back memories of some of the great discussions we have had on GTO, specifically around left wrist cupping and right forearm pickups. Thought Id share what he told me and get some feedback. I suspect Shootin will be an advocate

The one I found most interesting was extensor action. He explained about trying to get the feeling of your right wrist cupping and left arm stretching at address or as the first move in the backswing. To do this you do more than just cup the right wrist ( as was discussed in the secret and waggle threads), you feel as though your right heel pad pushes down on your left thumb and 'stretches out' your left arm. To me it felt slightly tense but that was a good feeling he said. He said this was Jack Nicklaus' first move, his forward press?

Once you had this extended left arm, flat left wrist and right wrist cup , you then sued your right forearm/elbow to lift this stretched left arm to the top. Dont cock your wrists to do it and keep that stretched feeling in the left arm. Felt weird to me but also very powerful. The left arm felt tense and taut, somrthing I always cionsidered to be a big no-no?

On the way down he explained how he felt how he pushed down with his right hand, like pushing the right palm down on top of the ball again keeping that extension in the left arm. He showed me how with the flat left wrist and cupped right wrist, if you did this right you would come from the inside, keep the left wrist flat through impact

Seeing as I have been experminting with some success with that right forearm pickup I felt these new actions added real power even though I was a bit hit and miss with them to be honest .. but id be interested to know Gregs thoughts and some of the other better players and evem some guys who may know more about TGM than I do

Greg

Im assuming this is also extensor action?

http://www.golf-tuition-online.com/g...hlight=Tension (Good Extension and a way to achieve it)

As I was reading your post, I was thinking about that post link you added! And yes, this is exactly that.

I learned a lot from the golf swing by a TGMer, He did not simplify extensor action, quite like I read in "the new golf swing". In that move you are describing about the heal pad, you get the cup before the cock. The guy you were talking to is most likely a hitter and not a swinger, there is a BIG difference between the two and you need to be careful not to mix certain components. ask him next time which one he is. In a hittng motion, which I can do with great accuracy on six irons, using excessive hip motion can be detrimental.

Whats interesting Greg is he never spoke of shoulder turn. For him he got this extensor action set up by pushing down with his right heel pad on his left thumb and then continuing to push. Pushing down with the right hand to pull the left up. First thing this does is cup the right wrist and flatten the left, then as you keep doing it you feel the left arm stay extended to the top, at which point the wrists are in perfect position and the left arm nice and long

From there he spoke of either hitting (i.e. using the right hand and arm to push the club dowb) or swinging (pulling with the hips/lower body). He was a hitter where it sounds as if your pupil was a swinger ? EDIT@ Shooting I just saw your post after I typed this so does this make sense to you?

I was very impressed and plan to try a few of these things out for myself

He aslo mentioned some instructional videos by Tom Tomasello which I have downloaded this morning and will look at tonight

Shooting, he said for him that personally wrist cock was a bad concept. Wrist cup, extensor action and right forearm/elbow lift were his concepts. This ties in nicely with what I have been working on for a while but I had no idea this was TGM related ?

yes, hitting makes sense to me. For me it was VERY easy to learn with mid irons but to hit with driver is difficult for me and not as long for me but that is only ME, Jason gore is a hitter and he puts it out there a few yards. The majority of great players use a swinging motion and a shoulder turn take away. But for some people hitting is easier and better. If a player is a swinger but cannot take his right arm out of the swing, meaning uses the right arm too much, then changing to a hitter might be the better option. Also, if someone does not have as much time for practice then maybe hitting would be a better option there too. Go to a tgm guy and get some lessons, but up front ask him if he thinks hitting or swinging is a better way. If the guy says hitting is better, then I may not go back to him. If he says that swinging is better but hitting is a good option for some people, then I would try that one out.

the wrist cup thing is one of the reasons that I said the waggle was one of the most important movements in golf and the reason for the thread on cupping and cocking. I did not mention a whole lot about TGM because most people get scared of it when using words like extensor action and elbow plane. I am not even close to being a TGM expert but by learning from a TGM guy I learned a lot more about the swing in laymens terms

What is the differnce between a hitter and a swinger. I'm new to golf. Still playing par 3 courses and the range. There are approximately 8.3 b'zillion conflicting tips from the pros. Next week I'm going to learn the newgolfswing. I'm in no way convinced it's the best since none of the pros use it, but it does have its advantages. It has a recipe. This is the way you do it and it works. May not be the best, but after reading the book, I'm convinced it can produce a repeatable powerful swing. Wish me luck. I'm not looking forward to unlearning everything I've already worked so hard to learn.

For is TGM for goodness sake???

Chessbum...

Sorry. Newbe here. Dont' know what TGM is either.

a hitter is someone who uses primarily their rear arm. The main movement is pull it back and push it forward
a swinger uses the body and the hands are just along for the ride for the most part
TGM is The Golfing Machine and is a book that is very complicated, It is the swing broken down by a an engineer and divided into components, but those who know it well tend to know quite a bit about the swing. go to www.thegolfingmachine.com

You learn something everyday. I though I had seen, read or looked at about every piece of literature on golf but never heard of "The Golfing Machine".

Thanks,

Chessbum...

Shooting

He seemed to have a lot of similarities with a One Plane Swing takeaway IMO, only how it got there was different. He used the cupping motion of the right wrist to get the club low and behind him as his takeway move, left arm tight to the chest. He practiced this move as his waggle. From there he just kept pushing back and the club would set on its end naturally as right arms folded up. Left arm was straight, almost hyper extended and tight to the chest. Swing looked very flat but from there he could hit the ball as hard as he wanted with his right hand/forearm. Naturally his bad shot was a hook or a draw he couldnt control

what it may look like and what it is, two different things. In a hitting swing your pull back with the right arm and that pulls the left arm across the chest, there is very little left arm involved in the swing, where as in the "one plane swing" your try to get the left arm across the chest by using it. THe reason he fought the lefts in a hitting stroke is probably because he got too much lower body into it. The rotation of the body when hitting is because of the right arms actions making it happen, where as in swinging it is more that the body that moves and the arms react to it