Chip & Run - How far?

First an apology, I know I've seen a thread on this before (Greg possibly) but can't find it easily.

Most advice I see on this is a variation of the "Rule of 12", i.e subtract the club from 12 to get the flight / role ratio.

For example a SW would be 1:1 (12 -11), the chip will roll the same distance again as the flight.

Nice & easy to remember and calculate except that - whether its my technique, or the greens, or whatever it never seems to work out like that.

Do any of you have a better rule of thumb?

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I firmly believe that we should try to experience all that life affords, except, perhaps, bestiality and of course Morris Dancing.

And to add to this question, how far should your backswing be for a chip?

Dave Pelz talks about how the PW is roughly a 1:1, and the 7 iron is roughly a 1:3 (carry:roll). The other thing Dave mentions, however, is that it's simply a guideline - and that you need to spend time on the greens figuring out what the 1:1 club is for YOU.

Ah, that's more what I see when I get a nice clean chip - having fat / thin problems at the moment.

I'm just looking for a simple starting point to apply the up / down slope, fast / slow green, where would I prefer to leave it, type variables, so Pelz is good enough for me.

As for backswing length, I'm working on "hands past knee" + "hands to hip" on the basis that if I get consistent carry with these two swings and apply the right ratio then I must be there or thereabouts at the moment.

The only thing i'd say about this shot is to make sure you don't lift your head as this will result in a fat/thin shot. Also make sure accellerate through the ball.

Greg that whole site is excellent and some really usefull tips on there. Apologies for not already knowing this but you're obviously a golf pro?

My Profile is on the "Staff" link at the top:

http://www.golf-tuition-online.com/gregjwillis.php

Oh dear I feel a bit dumb not looking there but thanks anyway Greg.

I tend to temper the minimum flight maximum roll principle with the desire to give myself a safety margin on getting on the green but I suppose that only reflects what's possible for me.

Here I said:
"if you have the room to land the ball in a reasonable clean spot that will get you a consistent roll (like the green/fringe or nice fairway) then use it"

So this "reasonable" spot assumes some things.
* Your ability to get it there. So lie plays a lot and your confidence in the shot...
* The landing spot's cleanliness

Thats quite a story you have there Greg. Do you play/have much success in tournament golf now?

hi
nick faldo use to always try and pick a spot 6 feet onto the green and chip to that. he would chose the club that would give him the run to the hole from there, taking in to it if it was uphill or down. he would not think of what club to chip with then but only think if he hit the spot then what club gave him the run to the hole and he then worked backwords as to picking the right club.
like lowpost says if faldo had 10 yards from his spot on the green to the hole and he was 20 yards away on the fairway a 7 iron would give him a 3:1.
think most off us work the other way, pick a club to reach the green and them what will run to the flag i know thats how i use to do it for years. think faldos way of finding the right club and plez 4 wedge system work good together.
bill

The last tournament I was in I was 5 under through 9. Then finished even. So, both problems: not enough play and not enough practice.

As far as how much backswing you need, just get a feel for it. It is hard to figure a certain length back swing. A pro demostrated it to me this way: Stand next to a green with a ball in hand. Take a look at the hole, turn away, then turn back and with hole in sight and pitch the ball onto the green with the thought of getting the ball close to the whole. Or you could do it more generally and pitch it to land at the edge of the other side of the green so you don't have such a small target to worry about, just speed and pitching distance to get it to stop at the edge. Don't hesitate too long, just turn and pitch it. Try it from different lengths. You will find your body makes adjustments without thinking about it too much. Have you ever pitched coins before trying to land on a line. Winner gets the coin. One doesn't think about how far a backswing is needed.

One really important point: You must acclerate through the ball. Deceleration is a killer. Whatever backswing don't let the club head slow down coming into the ball. Have a nice follow through.

hi
use the plez 4x4 wedge system and that way you know how far each shot will go with all your clubs,.
bill